Tagged: pantone color match
July 12, 2021 at 4:40 pm #281132
Hi fellow Hagglethonians!
Ok, so I didn’t even discover HH existed until just before the STL Kickstarter launched, and I am very excited and looking forward to printing and painting the buildings. But, that’s a bit of an issue as I discovered, since most house paint manufacturers do not use Pantone color codes. Why Pantone? Again, researching the issue, I found a list of Pantone codes for the various parts of the buildings in a Kickstarter update for the first campaign for the physical buildings a couple of years ago.
After a lot of research, I discovered a multi-step process that yielded success in identifying specific paint colors from specific brands here in the U.S. Here’s what I did:
Started with the list of Pantone colors; for each one, I looked up the Hex code value on the Pantone website. This turned out to be a bit of a problem, since there are alternate versions of the same number on Pantone’s website, based on whether the sample is on coated (C) or uncoated (U) paper (they sell physical books which are exorbitantly expensive for my needs). I started looking up all the values for the uncoated paper versions, but later found that the paint manufacturer no longer carried some of those, so I had to go back and find the names for the coated versions.
I went to a website called “Encycolorpedia.com” and punched in the hex value for each Pantone value I found, whether U or C. Then, I scrolled down the list until I found the paint brand I was looking for, and wrote down the name and code for the color that most closely matched the hex value (usually the one on the left; sometimes the closest one on the right if neither the C or U version for that Pantone hex code was available on the manufacturer’s website).
I built a spreadsheet and built a master table with columns for: terrain region, Pantone ID, Hex Code, Paint Brand & Color Name, Paint code, and Color Swatch # (For example, Valspar has separate paint code numbers and paint swatch numbers: another step! But Behr did not).
I chose to look up the color names for Behr at Home Depot and Valspar at Lowe’s, the two biggest national big box hardware chains in the U.S. in my area.
I will share my results for the Behr (Home Depot) brand, and I do NOT claim these are exactly the same as the factory paint job, but they are literally as close as I could get, and I really tried. If you go to HD and get these paint swatches and all 12 8-ounce color samples, you’ll pay about $50 for all of it, and that’s about 4 square meters of paint per pot, enough for at least a full set of HH, probably. Don’t forget the wood stain! Johnny said he uses Resene Walnut, but that’s not available in the US. I recommend a water-based similar wood stain; the paints shown below do NOT look like the factory paint job until AFTER the wood stain is applied and dabbed off. Watch the “Painting your Hagglethorn Hollow” video to understand Johnny’s process before attempting this: https://youtu.be/vSKGt4tSVYc
Behr (Home Depot)
Tile Roofs – Base: Holly Berry, ECC-10-3
Tile Roofs – Highlights: Glowing Firelight, S-G-200
Rope on Thatch – That’s My Lime, T17-16
Windows & Doors – Honey Tea, MQ2-18* This was as close as I could get; you might want to try another brand to get closer
Wood Walls & Frames – Moroccan Spice, S250-7* This one looked a lot darker than the color in the video; I would test this with the stain and if it turns out too dark, maybe mix the base color with white, to lighten it, so it doesn’t get too dark after staining.
Labyrinth wall / Building vertical stone bricks – tan color: Crepe, PPU7-19
Labyrinth wall / Building vertical stone bricks – lighter cream color: Moon Dance, 380-C
Cobble floors & walkways – darker gray: Pencil Sketch, N500-4
Cobble floors & walkways – Johnny’s “weird color”: Luscious Lime, P330-7
Spackling, plaster masonry on vertical walls: MIX WITH 50% WHITE: Primitive Green MQ4-40* (it doesn’t look green at all)
Weathered rock on bases – Terrace Taupe, PPF-33
Again, this is just one set of paint swatches from one manufacturer that is surely NOT the same brand as the factory paint job, but the closest approximation if you only want to go to one store. If you follow the method I described, you can find paints in just about any brand in any country, using the Encycolorpedia.com website and the Hex code values for the Pantone color numbers Johnny gave us.
July 13, 2021 at 3:01 am #281165jjacobs228Participant
Thanks for getting into the weeds on this! Once I get a few printed this will surely come in handy!
July 14, 2021 at 9:09 am #281277
UPDATE: I noticed I left off the Pantone color numbers for the Thatch; here is the original list in the post:
Tile Roofs – 7628, 7580
Thatch Roofs – 458, 460
Rope (Rigging on Thatch Roof) – 615
Windows and Doors – 467
Wood (Walls and Framing) – 464
Brick Walls – 7501, 7499
Cobble Floors and Walkways – 7539, 457
Spackling (wall plaster – stippling) – 7500 (mix 50% White)
Rock – 7536
Stone (Stretch Goal Statues) 7539, 428
UPDATE 2: I had a hard time when I went to find the color swatches at Home Depot; many of them were no longer available. I found a paint store with a Pantone color book, and went to their paint chip section to find equivalents, and it was nearly impossible. I took pictures of the Pantone chips that go with the numbers given by Tabletop Troubadour, and tried to locate color swatches with a different paint and store brand using the same process.
Ultimately, I am not sure the factory paints can be matched exactly; I would just go by the painting Hagglethorn instructional video, keeping in mind that the wet paints in the video will be lighter than when it dries, and also that the given Pantone colors *MAY* be based on a finished piece, rather than the original pre-stain paints. Just keep in mind that following JFA’s method will give the closest results, whatever paints you end up finding. I plan to do some experimenting with pre- and post-stain paint looks, and if I can find a set of named paints in any brand that match, I will share those here, but for now, I am just wishing I had a factory original to use as a guide. Also I tried to edit my original post, but that’s not allowed, so I added this update, and may have to add another one as these experiments progress.
July 14, 2021 at 9:27 am #281279Mike (Printable Scenery)Participant
Wow, that’s amazingly comprehensive! Thanks for sharing your findings!
I’m sure this will go along way helping others match colors for their Hagglethorn.
When we put up our painting guide for Hagglethorn we’ll be sure to reference your research in the painting guide 🙂
July 14, 2021 at 9:33 am #281281
Thanks Mike, but as I mentioned, it’s been very difficult to match the paints, and I would not want people to base their paints on these exact colors; ultimately it may be a mix of the color codes and eyeballing it against posted photos online. I’m still experimenting, and the only way I could really be sure they were right would be to have a sample of the factory-painted buildings, which I may end up getting at some point just for reference.
July 16, 2021 at 9:22 am #281484Mike (Printable Scenery)Participant
I hear you!
For my personal collection, I often take the model paint to the hardware store and have them match it as close as possible. It won’t always be 100% but on a large scale its still consistent. We’ve done it so many times now they have some of the Army Painter names in their database (we can just ask for a pot of dungeon grey!).
Matching photos can also be hard when lighting conditions can alter the look of an image so much but it’ll still get you most of the way there.
I think you’ve provided an excellent starting point for many people looking to match the factory schemes!
July 14, 2021 at 9:35 am #281282
I actually had better luck matching Valspar paints at Lowe’s using the number-match process, but I still wasn’t 100% on those and had to guess on a few. I did notice the undercoats tend to be cooler colors and the highlights tend to be warmer, but it all warms up after the stain wash.
July 21, 2021 at 6:07 am #282119
July 31, 2021 at 9:04 pm #294393CrisParticipant
I’m also trying to match the Pantone colours to the Dulux system (I’m from the UK), which has been pretty easy to do using their app.
I saved the Pantone C (coated) colour swatches from the Pantone website and then used the Dulux app to find the closest match based on the saved photo, to avoid introducing any colour variation by taking photos. I know there will be some discrepancy based on the fact these are hex values, however they should be close enough for this purpose.
What I wasn’t expecting though were so many similar colours.
In the video, Johnny only has 9 pots of paint and he seems to reuse some of the colours while painting the models.
The Pantone list contains 15 different colours!
I also noticed in the YouTube video, the first base colour Johnny uses is a cream/light brown colour, more like Citadel’s Zandri Dust. He says that it is the same as Citadel’s Steel Legion Drab, however that is a much darker brown. Did he get this confused, or is the video colour, way, way off?
It would be great to have a list of what colours were used by the factory for the original parts.
Otherwise I guess it will be a case of look at the pictures and go with what looks good.
August 1, 2021 at 1:18 am #294430
So, after watching the video a bunch of times, trying with the Pantone colors, etc., I ended up using my iPad to take screen shots of the paint pot lids and then using the Behr (Home Depot’s main brand like Dulux) app to select areas of the image multiple times until I got a palette that looks close for all the main colors. I bought a pot of Citadel Steel Legion Drab and yes it is too dark to be the undercoat color; what he is using as a base layer for the buildings is basically a khaki color with maybe a slight greenish-Gray tinge. But If you plan to do the walnut stain all over treatment, it will blend everything nicely.
Two things to keep in mind: I have read and talked to several owners of the factory painted models and seen unboxing videos, and the factory results range from slightly inconsistent to wildly divergent in terms of quality and keeping to the paint scheme in the how-to-paint video. Also, very slight variations are not perceptible by the human eye, especially since a lot will depend on the results of the final stain. Finally, he did mention a light dry brush pass *after* the all over stain coat, such as on the rocks and thatch. So I think this is a case of “close enough is good enough” and the minor variations are part of the organic charm. I also think it might be good to choose a water based walnut stain if you are going to do that step. Easier cleanup and quicker drying.
The one thing I think these models need is lots of moss in the cracks and crannies, depicted as light to dark green flocking stuck on with PVA-water mix dribbles. That bit of color contrast will really help, especially if you do it in the shadowed areas and in between the stone wall pavers especially where the greenish brown stones are. I’ve given up matching Pantone colors.
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